The Road Back Podcast

# 10 – The Camino Ahead

• Melissa Runacres & Desiree Amariei • Season 1 • Episode 10

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In our Season One finale, we celebrate ten episodes and look ahead to our Camino de Santiago pilgrimage. (Season 2 begins November 19, 2025.)

We share stories from past journeys, explore themes of trust, growth, and community, and remember: the road back is not about finding something outside of ourselves, but rediscovering the truth that everything we need for healing is already within.

Dez also announces her 12-week 2026 mentorship for coaches. Check out the details here:

https://desireeamarieiconsulting.squarespace.com/

And her new 14-day guided Camino journal here:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FMGTTP9Y?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

Follow for all new episodes, released every Wednesday.

Let's stay connected!

The Road Back Podcast socials:

Instagram: @the.road.back.podcast

YouTube: youtube.com/@TheRoadBackPodcast

Hey friends, welcome to episode 10 of the podcast. And it is actually the final episode of season one. That's pretty exciting. We're 10 episodes. I know we're in the double digits. And I remember reading that most podcasts don't make it past 10 episodes. Like out of all the podcasts out there, the vast majority don't make it past 10. So I feel like we've reached a milestone today, Dez. Go us. Go us, high five virtually. I'm so proud of you. thanks, and you. So one of the things that we decided even before we started the podcast was breaking our podcast into seasons, and that's what we're going to do. So after this week, we're gonna have a two week break, and then we're gonna be back on the 19th of November. And one of the reasons we are taking a break is because are embarking on a journey together. Yes, we are. Today's format is going to be a little bit different in that I'm going to interview Dez because the trip we are going on is to Europe to do a special walk. And so Dez, how about you tell us a little bit about what we're doing, where we're going, because the reason I'm going is actually because of you. What are we going to do? Well, we are traveling to Portugal and we'll begin the Camino de Santiago, which is a UNESCO World Heritage recognized pilgrimage, one of the four or five that's recognized in the world. And this particular pilgrimage participates from all different religions and even people who don't have a spiritual faith that they're practicing will do this journey and it ends in Santiago de la Compostela which is in northern Spain where the bones of St. James is said to be buried and for over a thousand years, people have been journeying from all over the world towards Camino de Santiago. It is unique because there's many different, what they're calling the way. And actual path is called The Way, the Camino means 'the way.' And so there's ones through Portugal, there's ones that traverse from France all the way the northern part of Spain, some from the bottom of Spain near Seville and through Madrid and through the center. All of them are considered parts of the pilgrimage. There's people in Europe, in Poland, who start in Poland and who will be... walking for months and months at a time in order to get here. And that was very true to the ancient pilgrim who spent day and night they were in the elements and making their way to this location. So we're starting in Portugal and we will be doing the Portuguese route. Yeah. Yes. Can you speak a little bit more to pilgrimages to people who don't know what a pilgrimage is? Because you've alluded to it, but would I be correct to say that it's got roots in Catholicism? Correct. Yes, it's usually it's deeply spiritual. The Catholic faith in general will consider a pilgrimage as penance as a way to reflect, as a way to go inward, to repent, notice what's happening inside of them in order to get to where they want to be. It's a beautiful discipline and practice that the Catholic Church will do and participants will There's other pilgrimages like the one Mecca in Saudi Arabia that's Muslim. And so I can't speak much knowing about that, but that's also a very spiritual and holy walk. Mm-hmm. know in the Bible, obviously, there's the pilgrimage towards Jerusalem that's recognized and known. I know there's one also in Japan, but it's really about connecting to yourself, to the spiritual aspects of yourself, the physical, because your body is moving and exposed to the elements and exposed to life along the path, along the way towards higher spiritual growth or towards enlightenment. It's an introspective walk. It's a deeply introspective walk. And I think that even if you were to go without a clear intention, you would end up with something. A real gift at the end. that sounds very intriguing. And I'm excited to walk on this with you. Now, this is not the first time that you have walked the Camino. Tell me about the last time you did it and even what drew you to do it when you did. Yeah, so I went in 2022 with my mom and my sister, which was a beautiful trip. My mom was celebrating a birthday. She invited all of her children to go with her. And my mom and my stepdad have been walking Caminos for over 15 years. They've done about 12 of them, about a dozen. No, different ones, yeah. So I have for 15 years seen their life, seen them travel, seen their love, seen how they come back transformed, seen the joy and the gifts of the Camino for them and their lives. And so right away, you know, 15 years ago or more, I knew I wanted to do it. I could tell in my heart I had a yes, but all the pilgrims believe that if the Camino calls you, then there will be a way for you to get to the way. And it's just a matter of time. case, it took over 15 years for me to finally get there. being able to go in 2022 and celebrate my mom's birthday was such a gift with my sister. And it had so many unexpected, beautiful stories. that really changed my life and the experience itself has had lasting effects. What would some of those effects have been? Were there any markers that you could say before or after? Well, there's so many, to think about leaving your family and your children, it was stretching a lot of my beliefs around my worthiness around doing that. Am I allowed to leave my kids for 20 days and walk? Am I allowed to take this much time for myself? That took about 15 years to get settled in my system, that that was a big part. In 2022, the Camino landed at such a good time because I had been doing so much internal work in transforming so many things. And one of new truths that I was leaning into was this belief that pain is inevitable in life, but suffering is optional. And I tried to grasp how to hold that – I understand that pain is a part of life but not take on suffering? And so one of the things that I walked about, every day for six or seven hours, I would just have the intention of noticing where are the places that there had been painful moments in my life, but I had created suffering meanings with a lot of shame. Why did that happen that way? What did I do wrong? Is God punishing me? Did I miss something? Is he waiting for me to understand something that I didn't get? Was there something I could have done so this pain wouldn't have happened? That was a lot of what I wrestled through for a couple of weeks of walking. And these are the gifts of the Camino. During that time there was still COVID testing happening both ways. So you couldn't leave the country or enter into the United States without a test. And I had finished the Camino. It was such a beautiful experience. My heart and my life were completely transformed. And it was the day before I had to leave and within 24 hours, I had to take another COVID test to get home. And I had COVID. I didn't even feel sick. And I was stuck. And it was one of those moments where it was like, was such a perfect practice of what I had walked through for two weeks on the Camino, it was like, I get to choose what I believe about this moment. I get to choose exactly. a little bit painful, It's like instant opportunity to practical out the things that you've been pondering. Leave it to God and the Camino to just be like, okay, you've walked 300 miles. Now let's see how you do this, how you really walk it out. And I'm such a practical person. So thankfully God did that for me. But it was very challenging in the sense that I had been gone for 20 days. I had never left my family. Oh, so first time ever that they'd been away from you that long. they had ever been, yes. So they had emotions about it. It was really a moment where I get to choose what I was believing both about God and my life. And it felt so powerful. I had such a deep sense of me being in this situation instead of the situation happening to me, if that makes sense. Mm-hmm. And I think all that walking and all the work of it led me to this point. And I just want to tell you one of the miraculous stories. This is one of my favorites because we had to cancel our flights. We had to scramble and find someplace to stay. Well, it's because they had COVID too. My mom actually did not, but my sister did. And so she, my mom was like, I'm staying too. So we all just rescheduled and it was quite an adventure after an adventure. We had been waiting and days would go by and we still have a positive, COVID tests. We enjoyed ourselves to the best of our ability. We try to take care of ourselves. you even get sick? I had like post nasal drip. It was like the lightest cold I was like, this is, this is COVID? I was like, no, you're wrong. I had two tests. Cause I was like, please, this is wrong. Like something's not right. But the whole point is remember those seven or eight days where I was stuck with COVID, wrestling and processing it with God. I believe that we can walk through life with a certain perspective, with a suffering perspective of I'm the victim to this experience or there's shame attached to it. And so I have this prayer of help me to see you, God, in your perspective. Help me to see this the way you see this and then help me to live in this ability to hold both this is painful, it's kind of a bummer, but to not, making meaning that somehow this is the evidence that I shouldn't have come, right? Like, me prolong. That's right. I should have never done this. I made a mistake. I didn't hear God. I'm so selfish. You know, the shame narratives. And so, you know, this is like day eight and we knew those people really well. We were going down to the COVID test. We're like, we need to get home. You know, I was in Portugal for a month.

But I go in and that was the prayer of my heart:

help me to see what's going on. Even if this is another day of positive COVID tests, I want to see what you're doing, God. And I sat down in this chair and this adorable Portuguese lady with hazmat, know, just plastic gear, head to toe with her little, goggles. She comes in and she says, hello, my name is Jesus and I'm here to help you. And I was like, what? And she's like, my name is Jesus and I'm here to help you get home. And I was like, oh, I just started to cry, Mel. I was like, and she pulled down her little white hazmat and her name tag was Jesus. It was Jesus. And she was the most beautiful, freckled, beautiful Portuguese young lady I'd ever seen. And I got my negative COVID test. The next day I got on the flight. We made it home. I surprised my kids. I woke them up and snuggled them in bed and they were so excited. The reason I love to tell this story is because it's really remarkable, obviously, about how you really get to practice what you're learning. I think that the Camino is applying what happens internally on such an external level. We get to see it and feel it with our bones and our body, just what it's like to travel through life. And it was such a beautiful moment because in that time, I was like, from now on, I have so much evidence that creating all of these shameful narratives – it's worth delaying, you know, making a lot of meaning. Maybe there's something I'm not seeing and I can see this differently and hold it differently. to work it out in practicality, I mean, it's like those things that you can read about in books or you go to the conference or you take the class and you're like, woohoo, I've got some more head knowledge, but then actually working it out from your understanding on a logical level into practical life, feels like there was a big invitation for you to do that pretty quickly. honestly, I don't tell people a lot of this follow-up story, but my health got so bad because of some autoimmune problems. So because I had COVID, when I got home, I was so sick and my back had a lot of problems. I could barely walk for six months. I couldn't feel my right foot. And I mean, in terms of practical application, it wasn't all roses coming home. I was hit with deeper and deeper invitation to lean in. And I went to physical therapy because I couldn't walk. I was in physical therapy for months after the Camino. And guess what the motto of the physical therapy office was? So I'm laying there, everyone's doing workouts and I'm like, what exercises should I do? He's like, just sit down in the chair and stand up again. He's like, that's all for you right now. But they're wearing these shirts and I'm reading the back and it says, pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional. And I was like, of course I'm invited more and more. We've talked about the breadcrumbs of seeing God in the journey. You'd just got on this journey, you'd already been pondering this, but it's like he's going, Hey, hey, Dez, I'm actually, I'm still here. Like I can even put it on the shirts. I'm here. I'm with you in the process. He doesn't always take us out of the pain right away, but he is so faithful to walk us through. He never leaves us or forsakes us. It feels like that little breadcrumb of I'm still here. I know this sucks right now. I'm still here. I haven't left. still here. And the pain matters, but my presence is in the midst it. Yeah. Love that. will be with you. yeah, his presence being with us in the middle of it. that's such a fun story. And I've heard some of it before, but I'd forgotten about the Jesus lady. So that's just wild. I mean, I show everyone her picture. I'm like, look, that's Jesus who helped me get home. I'm curious to know, do you have another theme in mind going in this year? And tell me a little bit about how it even looks different from the last time you went. Right, well, in 2022, I went with my mom who showed me the ropes. It was such a great experience with my sister. And this time I'll be leading the trip. When I left, believe it or not, I knew that there was more Camino. I just didn't know how or when or what that would look like. And in 2024, as I was... reconnecting to my heart and the dreams inside of me, specifically for my business, I thought it would be a beautiful idea to invite my clients to come and work with me in an eight month mentorship where we'd really go after identity and dreams and goals. And it would culminate in another Camino in the fall. And this way we would mirror the walk and the journey, this path that we've been traveling together in the mentorship program. And we'd have this experience where, for one, I wanted to give the gift and invite other people if they were also feeling the call to the way of like, how can we walk this out? How can we get more practical? How do we create the space and the environment to really go in and connect with what's happening, what's shifting, what feels more real. And so, I'm taking five mentees and two colleagues, which was you and another dear friend of ours. So eight of us on the path and it's going to be such a special trip because of the history we've built with each other Mm-hmm. and the vulnerability we've shared in sharing our dreams and parts of ourselves. Honestly, it will be something so unique to each and every one of us. Your Camino, Mel, will be your Camino and I will have mine. And we will all have something so unique. And I think that there's something really healthy and really safe about us having our own paths, our own Caminos, but still belonging to a greater whole. And you'll see when you realize how many millions of people have walked this path over the thousands of years, you can really feel that you belong to something so much bigger and so much deeper than just you, but your path really counts. It's really important. You walking it out is vital for you. So, that's why I chose it and that's what we've been doing this year. What shifted in you from the last time you walked, looking back where you were, maybe emotionally, spiritually, the season of life you were in, compared to now, three and a half years later. What would you note about where you are and even the ways you've integrated some of those lessons from last time? What do feel the invitation is this time? Hmm. I feel like there's so much to share even in the way you asked that, I feel like the Camino has taught me to trust the process a lot more. And, I feel emotional about this, but I can tell that I also trust myself a lot more. I trust God, I trust the process, and I trust myself so much more than I did when I first started walking in 2022. Personally, I spend a lot of time walking and praying in the mornings. And this is a lot of time where I just commune with with Papa and he communes with me. And I'm like, ooh, what is it that you have for me? What is the intention that I bring in my heart so that I could walk intentionally for this path and for this particular Camino? And also, what can I let go of? What expectations do I have or how I think I should be? Because I'm the leader, right? how do I let go and soften and just be Dez, his daughter? How do I soften and be Dez the pilgrim? How do I get in a posture of receiving whatever it is that I'm supposed to receive? The beauty, the freedom, the space – really practically a break from work, a break from life and running errands and oh, it's so wonderful. All I have to do is just walk, walk and eat, just get from one place to the next place. These things are just true gifts for my heart. And so focusing myself more and more every morning towards being as present as possible to this Camino. I find walking a practice that helps me get into my body. And it's one of those things that I've not done lots of long hikes or treks. I've done camping but I know some people just love those long walks. But the times that I can say I've felt most in my body are days after I've been outside, physically active, doing something that's moving my body. And I think in society today, it's so easy to have more of a sedentary lifestyle, indoor lifestyle, screen-based lifestyle, and so getting outside, I notice the effects of even just being outside for a few hours and in prep for this Camino, we have to walk and... One of the things I've noticed is my husband and I will just go for walks together. And, after you walk five or six miles with one another, I mean, we've had a chance to talk, you know, maybe you're a bit hot and sweaty. I live in a hot climate. You know this too, being in hot climates. You're sweaty, you're hot. My hands are a little bit swollen. It's just one of those things. There's something different to being outside and walking in comparison to say being in a gym that that's indoors, you're on a treadmill, you're doing class, something like that. They're both great, for our physical body but the actual walking and being outdoors is very connecting for me, not to get just back in touch with myself, but just even being aware of nature. What would you say to that? I'm sure there's some resonance there since I know you walk even more than I do, Yeah. So I would like to preface, my mother is such a walker. So I was raised when my mom would just rise in the dark of the night and she would just walk for miles and pray. Yes. So this is something that feels, yeah, very cultural to me. And I had seasons where I did... long distance marathon running and I would wake up at night and run and now I walk. It's such a part of me. I don't feel myself unless I'm outside walking. So I walk in the rain, I walk in the cold. There's really nothing that will deter me. If it's hot, I wake up even earlier. It is an invitation for me to be myself and to connect and have that space where, I'm with my thoughts, I'm connected with my body, I'm connected to God in prayer. It's really significant time. It's not just about movement for me. It almost becomes its own meditative practice, would you say? Absolutely, absolutely. It is my meditative practice daily. I think that for the ladies, a lot of the feedback I'm getting is I can't even go to bed now if I don't walk five miles. My body's like, hello, we need to walk. And that's part of the Camino. It starts so much sooner, honestly. The Camino is not the moment we land and start following the seashells and that's something about the Camino de Santiago. There's seashells and yellow arrows. Those are the breadcrumbs for us. Those are the markers that that's how you know the way you'll walk a mile and then you'll see another arrow and that's how you know you're getting there. But the breadcrumbs or the seashells are before that they're in every early morning wake up and walking and praying and sorting out the things of our hearts on a day-to-day basis. And to be actually in country is just the cherry on top. It's just another path that helps us to see that we're on a deeper path anyways. We're on a deeper road back. Yeah. great, great thought because I was going to ask you, how do you see the Camino as linking even to the title of our podcast, which is The Road Back and so much of it is about journey and returning. Do you have any added thoughts that you would speak to in tying Camino and the concept of The Road Back together? When I was walking the Camino the first time, I was at a place where even in my own healing journey, I thought that there was going to be a destination. I thought that there was going to be a moment and I was like, she's figured this I'm not going to feel crazy. I'm not going to feel out of control. I won't be triggered. That's so funny. I won't have pain. My relationships will be beautiful. There will never be any struggle. So did you pin a lot of that onto that first Camino, a lot of hopes and dreams of I'll finish, I'll cross quote, quote, the finish line and all the suffering will go away. Yes, this is exactly what I'm trying to say. I realized that I had been doing that when I was actually walking. And I said, oh, I see. And I remember I was two days out the cathedral. So I was somewhere in Northern Spain. Actually, I do remember exactly where it was Calderes, where they have a lot of hot springs. I remember this moment. My feet were sore. You're kind of tired. Your body's feeling it. You're feeling good and tired at the same time. I remember putting my feet into the water and I remember thinking like it hit me just like this: actually this is not about getting somewhere. The thing I've been looking for, the peace, the safety, the love, the presence, the understanding. The ability to be inside of life and not feel like it was gonna take me out – I actually have it already. I have everything that I need right now. It's me, it's in me. I have it. I'm the thing that I've wanted. This God inside of me, I have all that I need. There's nothing outside that I need to look to externally. to show me that I have enough or to provide that safety. And yeah, that was a big moment for me. When I think about the road back, it's the path that leads you home to you, to that safety inside of you, to the love and the peace and Emmanuel, inside of you that you've always needed. So it helped me see. And one of the things they say at the end of a Camino, you get there and it's stunning and there's... Pilgrim's Mass and it's just so rich in culture. It's just so holy. Everyone's so emotional. You don't know people and you're just celebrating with them. It's fantastic. It's highly emotional. And then you realize, oh, this isn't the end. This is just another beginning. Like there aren't really endings. There's just beginnings. And even if you think of eternity, like the end of our human life here is just another beginning inside of of our eternal experience there. is there anything that in particular you're hoping or dreaming for, for the ladies that you're taking with you this time? What are you hoping that those of us who are walking with you would take away? One of my prayer intentions for this whole year has been that, and so this is for you as well since you're coming on the trip, that you would each meet the deep depth of belovedness inside of you and that you would commune and walk and fellowship with him. You'd break bread and take wine with him. And it would become something so... uh second nature and practiced and felt and known inside of you that it would just mark you and sustain you forever. Yeah. When you say that I can feel that intention hit me. I think the thing I'm drawn to is the ancient nature of it as well. You're walking a path that others have gone before – the blood, the sweat, the tears, literally for people who would have walked it hundreds of years ago and didn't have shoes. You mentioned at beginning, penance. I read or heard that if you had committed a crime, they would let you walk the Camino in lieu of going to prison. Is that correct? yes. It's quite remarkable because in ancient times you didn't have food. You were really dependent that the way would provide for you. Now we have backpacks, right? We have great sun hats. We got great shoes and poles and trekking. And, we can go to a cafe and get whatever we need to eat along the way in a day of travel. But it was quite different. It cost a lot and there was a lot of different reasons people were doing it. And so was a very significant experience and meant a lot to get there and it cost them everything. They have an incense burner in the chapel, in the cathedral, and they fill it with incense. And one of the reasons is because the people in ancient times would be covered with fleas and bugs and the incense would help purify them. And so when you see this, you understand we all be coming in and our REI gear. But that's not how it always was. People with blood, sweat and tears crawling in. They would crawl in. And that's also so beautiful when I hear you say we belong to a human race and our humanity is messy and it's dirty and it's stinky and it bleeds and it's really safe and beautiful acknowledge that inside of us and also belong in love in a community. Dez, you shared a bit about your experiences, your hopes, your dreams, the insights. Is there anything else that your heart wants to add that perhaps I haven't asked directly about this process of the Camino? What would you want our listener to hear? Even as they might not be physically walking a Camino themselves, but there's spiritual truths and applications here. Yeah, I think I would want to leave the listener with the profound truth that the way will provide. if you find yourself journeying through something right now, look around, ask Papa to show you what he's doing and how he's doing it. Maybe you'll find your Jesus in a hazmat suit. Maybe you'll find your little seashells or your breadcrumbs, but the way will provide, and it's a matter of time. Sometimes we don't see it. And there was many times I would walk a mile or two miles and I think, did I miss it? Did I miss it? And lo and behold, you will see the marker. You will see the next step. You will see the next breadcrumb. The Way will provide. And another belief that I firmly have is that everything you need, you already possess. So if you think about a hiker, like you have everything is quite simplified when you hike and you carry your stuff. But even in the more spiritual and emotional elements is like your body has what it needs for healing. Your soul possesses everything you need for healing. Your emotions and your heart have the presence and comfort that you need. Those would be two clear Camino beliefs that I would offer to The Road Back listener. So true. And such an important lesson that we can take in any chapter or season of life that we find ourselves in. As we wrap up our final episode of season one, you have some exciting things in the works that you are dreaming about and planning. Talk to us about what those are. So this is fun. Next year I am offering another way to work with me in a special journey that specifically business owners or life consultants or life coaches could understand their own special magic and embrace themselves inside the work that they're doing. I think that authentic embodied practitioners would be such a good gift to the world, to our humanity right now. So I'm really excited about this. Details of when we start in 2026 will be on my website, there's an application process. If you have any questions, feel free to email me. I'm really excited because I'm doing this with you. I'm gonna be partnering with your magic and your beauty and your gifts. And we'll be collaborating with other people as well. it's just gonna be a really special journey for us. Anyone who feels that call or maybe who's wanting to find their particular niche and their special lane inside the work that they do... the mentorship program is only 12 weeks. So it's slightly different. We're going to condense it in the spring. That way you have the rest of 2026 to implement the things that you're honing in in the beginning of the year so you could really go after it. There may be some surprises for the end of 2026, perhaps another Camino or perhaps another fun adventure. Stay tuned. Stay tuned for that. Mm. Very exciting. And I've seen firsthand the fruit that's come out of the lives of the people who've worked with Dez this year. It's been a huge honor and so rewarding just getting to walk with these ladies in community and see the impact of your gifts on their lives and see them showing up and doing the work and putting one foot in front of the other. Sometimes what the road back is, sometimes we're sprinting down the path because we're so excited. Other times the capacity we have is just simply, I'm gonna take the next right step. We all experience seasons of both and the seasons of the in-betweens. And so it's been a real privilege. You guys will not regret working with Dez if you feel that call. Like we say, the Camino calling to us, ah there's a call. And if there's a resonance in your heart, I would encourage you, definitely check out the website and see what she has in store because there'll be something for you in it. one last plug. I created a journal specifically for those pilgrims who want to process their pilgrimage. It's a 14-day journal and it has prayer intentions, liturgy. It has polyvagal- informed exercises to help you get connected to yourself just to help you process. So the truth is I made it you ladies as a gift. I really wanted it to be done so that I could gift it for those were participating this year in the Camino de Vida mentorship with me, but it's available on Amazon. If you just wanted to process some of the life lessons of the Camino, you can. It's powerful reflection question. Maybe that's in your budget. So I just wanted to offer that as a resource, especially as we're talking about how The Road Back and the Camino align in a lot of ways So we'll include that link also Yeah. on my Instagram, on the YouTube. Friends, it's hard to believe – season one, that's a wrap. So excited to come back with more conversations, topics. We'll be launching season two on November 19th, Yeah, we'll see you on November 19th. Bye. See you then, friends. Bye!